Heard of PMMA (Medical Grade) OR Dr Casavantes?

[docsavage]

28 days post op. Going in 2 weeks for 2nd procedure.
6" length x approx 5" girth.

[skatezy777]

docsavage

Your results look really good, man. I assume since you posted your erect length at six, you haven't experienced any loss of erect length (I believe 6 was your pre-op)? And before you were 4.3 girth, right, so you've gained .7" girth?

Overall, are you happy with the results? Any problems or anything?

Thanks man for posting and keeping us updated. All the guys who have had the procedure and are answering questions really help everyone else out.

[bigbizo8]

Nice pic Docsavage, good luck on your next trip! Skatezy777 no problem buddy I use to ask a million questions so ask as many as u can think of.

[skatezy777]

Hey bigbiz,

Thanks for your patience. Have you been able to get a full erection yet? And you don't think the PMMA in any way is preventing you from getting one? Sounds like no one else has loss length, so I can't imagine why you would.

[sparticus]

I really wish there were more long term studies on this and more explanations as to why the newest generation of Artecoll (Artefill) is still having cases of granuloma formation. Arnold Klein, one of the top dermatologist and innovators in injectable fillers has spoken out loudly against Artefill and PMMA based long term fillers. He is not a no-body just making claims, he is world renowned.
I am going to wait on this procedure until more information and studies comes out. I'm going to post more studies as I find them and as they are produced. Hopefully more long term evaluations are done. I am also curious about research results for long term enzyme effects on the PMMA. Some researchers have hypothesized that certain enzymes in the body can react with the PMMA over time causing it to change in shape and shrink in size. Both size and shape were shown to be contributors to granuloma formation (irregular or edged shapes) and migratory issues (small size beads allowing phagocitosis).

I would like to thank those who have had the PMMA procedure for continuing to post on this forum and keep everyone updated. The reports so far have been positive and though I hope they remain that way, I also encourage you guys to please keep us updated if something goes wrong. I know it will be a tough emotional experience for you if something happens and you may not want to return to the forum (as has been shown in the past) , but by reporting any negative issues you will be saving someone else or many others from problems that could be even worse than yours and could ruin someone's life. Once again, thanks for keeping us updated and I hope this procedure continues to be as positive for you guys as it has been so far.

[sparticus]

Has Casavantes commented on the "ring" phenomenon some patients are experiencing? Did he say he can smooth it out in the second round of injection? I'm not fully understanding why some have experienced the "ring" and others have not.

[skatezy777]

Hi sparticus,

I agree that I wish there was more long-term data available. Who are you referring to who DID NOT have the ring? From all the results I have seen, everyone has had the ring.

[skatezy777]

And also sparticus thank you for your constant scrutiny; it encourages all sides of the issue to come out.

[sparticus]

EvilPneivel did not have the ring. Maybe someone else didn't get it either, but he is the one on the top of my head. I honestly couldn't tell any difference in terms of aesthetics in E.P's results, he honestly looked 100% natural. The ring is not terrible in any one, but it is noticeable enough for me to identify it.

No problem Skatezy777, I'm just trying to get the facts on everything and weigh my options. I'm willing to share whatever I find as I know everyone else is in the same boat and has many of the same concerns and insecurities about their size as me.

[sparticus]

Not a study, but just a board where dermatologists, plastic surgeons, and other physicians can respond. Several questions were asked regarding Artefill and PMMA, just dig through the site and you will get to see some of the questions and the response from the doctors.

www.realself.com/question/artefill-removal-any-cost

[hoddle10]

@ Sparticus

I think what you need to keep in mind is that you are highlighting the risks associated with PMMA and thus we compare it with doing nothing. A 3% (a pure guess, I'm sure i read far lower) occurance of granuloma's may seem alot compared to the zero chance when not having PMMA. However, compared to the complications with FFT, Elist implant, Alloderm and Dermal grafts, it's a small percentage. The reason we are concerned about the chance of immune reaction or granuloma formation is that it could mean surgical removal is needed and it is in surgery that the greatest chance of serious damage to our penis's will occur. With every other option you have to have an initial surgery, which you don't with PMMA. The chances of infection with the Elist implant, alloderm or dermal grafts are much, much greater. The chance of serious nerve damage is also massively increased with surgery. Then there is the risk of fibrosis casing shortening, which PMMA doesn't have, but the other methods do. Hence straightaway, despite possible complications down the road, PMMA seems to be a lower risk option, as it avoids the pitfalls of surgery, which alone seem to have a far greater complication rate, than occurence of granulomas in PMMA.


PMMA means you'll avoid the dangers of the intial surgery, but I'd also say it's the least likely method to require further reconstructive surgery if things go wrong. Given the dangers of surgery, the method that means you are least likely to need a second surgery, is likely to be the safest. Over the years I've come across lots of guys who have required reconstructive surgery to remove lumpy FFT (i had this myself), partially absorbed dermal grafts, hardened alloderm and unnatural silicone implants. I'd say as many as 25% of guys who have PE sugery will require a later reconstrucive surgery, again running lots of risks. Now if a small percentage of PMMA patients have granulomas or inflamatory rections later on, then surely that's much better than the percentage of guys requiring secondary surgery to fix problems at the moment. Some claim as many as 50% of Elists patients have to go back for further surgery and given the erosion seen in ED implants, it would seem likely that within 15 years, that isn't 100%.

People like Arnold Klein seem to be anti PMMA because it can't be removed and doesn't dissolve. Hence if something goes wrong, serious surgery is needed to cut it out. If you have PMMA in the face (Dr Klein specialises is facial fillers) and granulomas occur, the only way to get the out, is to cut them out, leaving serious scarring, badly disfiguring the patient. Hence he's anti PMMA. But is the penis like the face? Doesn't the penis have a surgical entry and exit point (ie the circumcision scar) that the face doesn't have. A surgeon can enter through the circ scar and peel the skin back, in the same way he does for most penis surgeries. Now obviously there is still the risk of damaging the facias and skin, which could cause necrosis. But those risks are also there in the even more likely event that one would require removal of alloderm of FFT. So when Dr Klein speaks out against PMMA, he obviously isn't doing so in comparison with other PE methods and the concerns he does have are more likely to be harder to correct in the face than the penis.

Unfortunately there just isn't a safe way to enlarge the penis. If there was PE surgery would be as popular as boob jobs. So all we can do is look for the safest method available. I believe that to be the method that offers acceptable results, but with least exposure to the surgeons knife. At the moment I believe that to be PMMA. I've read every report I can find on the stuff, but did so knowing it was going to reveal lots of potential problems. However, I knew I had to compare these problems with other methods of PE and not to the safety of other minimally invasive cosmetci procedure such as Botox. From Dr Kleins point of view PMMA would seem to risky, but from a perspective PE candidate, it seems much safer. I think we all know the safest thing to do is not have anything done to our penis's, but sadly many of us are so consumed by the fact we feel as if we are lacking in that department, that by not doing something about it, we are arguably doing even more damage to our well being.

[skatezy777]

sparticus

It looks like EP has "some" ring-ish features (look at his post op pics 10 and 28 days after), but I agree that it is not really noticeable at all.

@hoddle

You make several good points. Personally I am drawn to PMMA because of the less invasive nature of the procedure.

[skatezy777]

Also, did anyone have a bovine allergy test done before the Artefill was injected? There is apparently a 3 percent chance of an allergic reaction, and normally a test must be done four weeks in advance

www.dermnetnz.org/procedures/collagen.html
www.artefilldallas.com/aboutartefill.htm

[skatezy777]

Also, I'm wondering why Dr. C. can't use a temporary filler, like Radiesse or Restylane.

[Skeptical One]

As for penis rings, someone somewhere in the midst of these many many pages said that Dr. C explained that it had something to do with the circumcision scarring...I'll see if I can find it.

As for safety, I believe both opponents and proponents of PMMA are both lacking in serious long-term studies. Furthermore, the studies based on PMMA for penile application are probably limited to those actually performing it. With this being said, I think Hoddle is right when stating that no method is truly safe. If we decide to undergo a procedure, our best bet is to select the one with the least chance for complication.

I have been pleased with the live results from our members, but I know all too well that it would be too premature to draw any conclusions at this time. I myself am strongly considering PMMA as a part of my plans this year, but like sparticus, I am trying to hold out as much as I can to learn what I can in the meantime.